Q&A: Karin Fischer discusses evolution of international education

Karin Fischer, a senior writer for The Chronicle of Higher Education, visited Lehigh during International Education Week to deliver a keynote address to campus community members and discuss recent trends within the higher education and international education fields. 

Fischer began her career as a political journalist in Washington, DC before moving to Los Angeles, California to work for The Chronicle covering politics and policy. About a year and a half later, a single project on international education propelled Fischer into her present role as one of the leading international education reporters in the country. 

She reports on the economic, cultural and political divides within American colleges and universities, and writes a weekly newsletter, Latitudes, on her opinions regarding current global higher education issues. 

Could you tell me a little bit about your background, how you got started in journalism, and what drew you to the field of higher education?

I was a college student journalist as well at a liberal arts college (and) was editor of the student paper. I had a number of internships when I was in college…I’d always like to write, so that was a big piece of it. And I don’t know about you, but I’m sort of a shy person, but journalism is a license to talk to people and to talk to people about things that it would probably be impolite to ask them in other circumstances. And so I liked just hearing other people’s stories and getting to explore all these new lives (and) new ideas. 

I was a political reporter for a few years. I worked in and covered state legislature, and then came to DC and covered Congress. And I’m a bit of an accidental both higher education and international education reporter…I hadn’t really set out to write about education at all, and I hadn’t as a political reporter. I must have done a couple of stories about education policy, but not a lot, but it was one of the many types of transitions in journalism.

I read the Chronicle when I was in college. We got it at the newspaper, so I was familiar with it, and I just kind of honestly applied, and I was hired to cover politics and policy there. But a couple of years in, maybe a year and a half, I got asked just to do a single story, actually a single project on international education. And I just found it really interesting. It kind of spoke to all the things I was interested in, in journalism. You’re seeing even greater variety of stories, and you’re just getting to delve into these things (and) these people’s lives that you would not be able to (otherwise). And so I don’t think I intended to either stay in higher education journalism or to become an international education (journalist) for a long time, but I have because it’s always interesting. There’s always new stories and new developments and new ideas and new people. 

What challenges have you faced in the field? 

I had been covering politics, and then I stopped, but my job has become a lot more about covering politics again in a way that it wasn’t initially. I mean, I don’t think that either higher education itself or international education was nearly as contentious as it is now…I’ve been doing this for long enough that I covered the first Trump administration, and so I hopefully will be better positioned to cover it now, because the first time around, I was like, “Wait, they’re doing what?” And it’s affecting people. The travel ban happened, and (international students) got stranded. 

I think the other challenge I have is (that) besides covering international education, I write a lot about the educational divides in this country. So I write a lot about public perception of higher education, and we just went through the election, and one of the biggest divides was educational attainment. And so I think my job — because I’m writing for a large like a college audience — is trying to make sense of that, to tell them why. Why is there such stark differences in the way people see the world based on education? And why do some people have resentment or anger or distrust of colleges? 

Over the past couple of years, have there been any particular trends or shifts in international higher education that you’ve noticed or found especially noteworthy?

There’s the pandemic. That was the big one in ways that I never really thought about. Actually, most international students stayed here, and then that was a whole new slew of challenges for colleges because often they were the only students on campus for that first year of COVID.

So it was very disruptive, and I think it made people sort of step back and say, ‘How can we be international if we can’t leave our houses, get on a plane and people can’t come here to campus.’ And so I think that it made people within the field of international education sort of step back and be a little bit more intentional about how they proceed. 

I also think it was a little bit existential for a while. I remember talking to one university staff member. He said to me, ‘I can’t keep planning study abroad programs that are not going to go anywhere, because I can’t keep planning delegations that are coming to our campus and it’s not going to happen. Like, why am I doing what I’m doing? It feels futile.’ And so I think, you know, both study abroad and international student mobility have rebounded since COVID. But I do think that it made people ask different questions (and) be more open. Does international education have to be getting on a plane? Does it have to be getting a Visa? And I think it’s just shifted how people think about the role of international education as part of what a college does.

Could you tell me about International Education Week?

International Education Week, I do think on a lot of campuses, is something that gives structure and prominence and reason (and) to talk about what international education is and what it does. I think it can be very easy on campuses to default to (thinking) you know somebody who studied abroad, and so that’s what international education is. Or your roommate’s from another country. International students are a very visible part of international education, but you know, (this week) is a time to focus more on some of those things and to elevate the conversation a bit. As a reporter, for me, it’s neither here nor there. It’s my job every week of the year. 

Why did you decide to come to visit Lehigh, and what do you think students need to understand about a future that’s becoming increasingly more interconnected globally?

I just jump at the chance to come to colleges and come to campuses. I mean, already this morning, I met with a class on global citizenship, and it was just a really interesting conversation. It wasn’t formal, but just talking about why they were in the class in the first place and what it meant to them to be thinking about their place in the world. Yes, I can Zoom with people, and yes, I can talk with people on social media. But it’s not the same as coming to a campus. 

I think we’re at a point where having a conversation about this is pretty critical because I think there used to be a broader acceptance of the idea of global interconnectedness and globalization, but now there isn’t as much consensus. I think that there is some rethinking about that. And I think it’s become kind of important for students to think about their place in the world, what their impact is and how they want to relate to people. 

Even in a place, in a state, in a small town, I think we are much more global now than we ever were. And so “international” doesn’t actually necessarily have to mean relating to somebody who’s in another country. It can be relating to somebody who’s in your own community, and you just haven’t had that sort of understanding of them. I think a lot of international education is precisely opposite to what I’m doing now. (It’s) not talking, but listening and getting to understand the commonalities and the similarities and the sort of motivations that can be universal, and then also understanding the very different contexts and concerns that people come from and how that affects and shapes their perspectives. I think finally you learn about yourself.

Can you think of anything you’ve seen at other universities that has been impactful for students, both domestic and international students, that you think a university like Lehigh would benefit from implementing?

One of the things about Lehigh itself is that intentionality — the effort to make global learning success more accessible to people. And I think that’s really talked about, but I do think there is a way in which international education (used to be) sort of a thing for elites always. Either you were very, very bright, or you had a lot of money to come and study in the U.S. 

Similarly, many people see study abroad as something that costs money (and requires) a passport. And people don’t often think that’s for (them). I’ve been most interested in the question of how international education tackles — and how colleges tackle — these questions of equity. We were talking earlier about COVID, and I think in one hand, COVID made it possible for people to do online, global experiences. They could connect with a class in another country, but then that just raises all these other questions: Yes, it increases access, but does it increase equity? Are we always going to privilege the person who goes and studies for a semester in Paris and has full immersion as being better? And what are we going to do to make sure that students do see themselves in international education? You just said that we’re in a more interconnected world than theoretically it should be something that everybody needs to have some experience and exposure to, and if people don’t feel like it’s for them, or they’re self-selecting out, they don’t.

To get back to your actual question, for example, the University of Kentucky has an interesting program. They started a cohort-based program for first-generation and low-income students, and they embed global education into that experience and have a study abroad experience. Perhaps, it doesn’t seem as much of a hurdle if you’re going with people that you’ve been classed with, right? And they also make it very specifically related to fields of study and to jobs. It seems more practical and relatable to people’s experiences.

What is one piece of advice that you would offer students?

I would go back to the piece about education being such a dividing line, and in a way, some of those divisions are longstanding and the result of who had access to higher education in the past. Those issues of access continue today…I think if we don’t want these educational divides to grow, we’re going to be reliant on students and on recent graduates to try to reach across what has become a pretty big bridge in this sort of diploma divide. 

It feels like there’s sometimes two different conversations entirely going on, and I’m not sure, quite honestly, for people who have been in one conversation or another for a long time that they are necessarily as receptive to hearing the other conversation. And I think that’s true on both sides…If we don’t want this to be an intractable and permanent divide in the country, it’s gonna really rely on people who can talk about why they went to college and why it’s important to them. 

What are the best practices for making sure everyone in the community feels comfortable and that they’re a part of it, no matter where they’re from?

It’s a real challenge — deep listening, honestly. I came into my job having had some experiences myself with international education, and I certainly did have some preconceived notions about people and their experience, but I try to shut up a lot and listen. I feel like sometimes people want to feel heard. So if you can commit to hearing people, it just makes the whole dialogue end up flourishing.

Maybe it’s actually easier to see in international education because international education is about difference, right? It’s about being from different places (and) having different experiences, and perhaps we don’t see that as much in our own lives (or) in our own communities.